TCM Treatments of COVID-19
Written in Chinese by Dr. Andy Lee, March 7, 2020 (http://andylee.pro/wp/?p=7660)
Translated to English by Dr. James Yeh, March 13, 2020
I published an essay “From SARS to Novel Coronavirus” in Chinese on January 21, 2020 (http://andylee.pro/wp/?p=7169). At that time, I tried to discuss possible Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) treatments of Novel Coronavirus based on my clinical experience of treating many severe cases of pneumonia caused by various influenza and other diseases. Since then, I have directly and indirectly participated in treating patients of Novel Coronavirus successfully, had discussions with many doctors fighting the epidemic at the front line and many researchers conducting related researches, and read many reports on this subject. Although the “Novel Coronavirus Pneumonia” has been renamed to “COVID-19” (coronavirus disease 2019) and the name of the virus has officially named from “2019-nCoV” to “SARS-CoV-2”, I now firmly believe that my original judgment, views, and interpretations are correct. For the sake of easiness for people to read and share, in this essay, I am reorganizing my previous discussions and including some explanations on certain confusions as well.
First, there are numerous provinces and cities in China using TCM to fight the “COVID-19” (I will use the term “Coronavirus” from now on.) No matter whether the treatments were primarily using TCM or the combination of TCM and the methods of Western medicine, there have been a significant amount of positive outcomes. On the other hand, the views of how to use TCM to treat and the use of corresponding herbal formulas vary quite a bit. Even when TCM remedies were effective, why did some patients fully recover and were discharged from the hospitals but other patients still could not get the virus-free “negative confirmation” from virus DNA tests?
Many TCM doctors participating in the treatments and discussions often look at the Coronavirus issue from a single “Point” or the condition of the patient at that specific moment. Some interpreted the disease as “Dampness” (濕), “Dryness” (燥), “Cold” (寒), or “Heat” (熱). (Translator’s note: These interpretations are often the opposite ends of the spectra, like Dampness is opposite to Dryness; and Cold is opposite to Heat.) From the clinical practice point of view, those treatments based on such conflicting interpretations all had positive effects to some degrees. Then, which interpretation is the “correct one”? In fact, those simple interpretations all have some merits but don’t fully cover the subject in hand. Although TCM is based on “Dialectical Treatment” (辯證論治), i.e. treatment is derived from “observation and diagnosis” of patients’ complex symptoms, the most important thing is that disease shouldn’t be viewed as an isolated problem at a specific time, but the whole development of symptoms along a timeline. Not only we need to observe and diagnose the current ailment but also we have to understand the development history of the disease and to project how the disease will develop in the future. For a single patient, we might be able to focus on the clinical results of this patient. But for epidemics, we have to look at a bigger picture and take into account how this Coronavirus develops health issues inside the human body from TCM’s perspective. And, in clinical treatments, we also need to consider many variants caused by each patient’s preconditions and one’s strength to fight off the disease.
From my experience of curing many patients who were inflicted with flu-induced pneumonia and complications, and the recent participation in treating and curing Coronavirus patients, it is proper to summarize that no matter whether the virus is Coronavirus, bird flu, swine flu, or the “common” flu, we found that the bodily deterioration caused by the virus, in general, follows the description from the TCM theory first covered in the ancient literature “Treatise on Cold Damage on Miscellaneous Disease ” (傷寒雜病論). However, the progressions of the disease from such special viruses are much faster, more severe, and/or more persistent than that of the common flu. Patients’ own original “health” condition also complicates the progression. (Translator’s note: For example, the infliction rate of young children is much smaller than that of adults for Coronavirus.)
As I explained before, the TCM theory discussed that for the common flu or “catching a cold”, the disease starts with “Exterior Deficiency or Weakness” (表虛). That is, the “exterior” of the body is invaded by the “External Pathogen” (外邪), like virus, and has adverse reactions. (Translator’s note: Here the exterior doesn’t mean just the outside surface of the body like the skin, but all the surfaces topologically exposed to the outside like lining of throat, nose, and bronchus of the body.) This is the first stage of the whole episode and often can be effectively treated with the herbal prescriptions such as “Gui Zhi Tang” (桂枝湯). If the patient is not properly treated, the body fluids within the surface and muscles could not function properly. It will cause the transition to the next stage “Exterior Excess” (表實). (Translator’s note: The word Excess has various meanings: excessive reactions all the way to neoplasm, excessive wasteful things, etc.) Viral infection at this stage is matched to one of the several syndromes named with the corresponding herbal remedies such as “Ge Geng Tang” (葛根湯), “Ma Huang Tang” (麻黃湯證), and others. The TCM theory calls this stage “Exterior Coldness” (表寒). In history, many TCM doctors considered this stage as the body being hurt by outside coldness (傷於寒) or in plain words “Catching Cold”. However, that is a misunderstanding. While outside coldness is one of the causes leading to the stage “Exterior Coldness”, it is not the only cause. When the body fluids could not function properly, the normal body fluids which had proper fluidity to circulate and to fulfill vital functions (活水) became a pot of “Dead Water” (死水), i.e. wasteful water which can’t fulfill vital functions. In other words, the ancient literature “Treatise on Cold Damage on Miscellaneous Disease” (傷寒雜病論) is much beyond the simple interpretation of how to treat the ailment caused by “cold damage”, but a classical literature of explaining both the physiology and pathology of human body functions.
Normally, the ailment or symptoms of the common flu would be limited at this stage of “Exterior Coldness”. Even without any treatment, the human body often could fight off the virus with an immune response and fully recover. But when the effects of Exterior Coldness started to penetrate into the interior of the body, the first common organs to be affected will be the organs that have a short path to the outside. (Translator’s note: Topologically, trachea and lung are only a membrane distance away from the outside air.) Then the Exterior Coldness gets transformed into the next stages such as “Interior Coldness” (裡寒) and “Lung Coldness” (肺寒). (Translator’s note: Here “Lung” means the whole respiratory system, not only the lung organ.) Clinically, the patients start to show symptoms of the syndrome named after its herbal remedy “Xiao Qing Long Tang” (小青龍湯). At this stage, the patients have serious coughing and running nose. When the respiratory system is “affected by the coldness”, the body fluid function of the respiratory system gets affected. Just like when the cooling system of a car malfunctions, the engine would overheat. The circulation function of the lung becomes “Dry and Overheated” (燥热). This would lead to the next stage of “Heated Interior” (入裡化熱) and often be matched to its herbal remedy “Da Qing Long Tang” (大青龍湯). At this stage, it does not mean that the whole lung is “dry and heated”. In fact, many pneumonia patients exhibit “mixed coldness and heat” (寒熱夾雜) in the lung. For example, while the upper part of the lung is “dry and heated”, the lower part of the lung might suffer excessive mucus of a high density. Pleural effusion and hydronephrosis might start to develop quickly.
Such a complex situation was extensively discussed in Chapter 7 of the ancient literature “Synopsis of Prescriptions of the Golden Chamber” (金匱要略肺痿肺癰咳嗽上氣病脈證治第七篇). At this complex stage, the illness development varies significantly among patients of different preconditions and other variants. It is no longer the situation that a simple herbal remedy can be applied to all the situations. The TCM theory illustrates various treatments by those herbal remedies such as “She Gan Ma Hung Tang” (射干麻黃湯), “Ting Li Da Zao Xie Fei Tang” (葶藶大棗瀉肺湯), ”Ze Qi Tang” (澤漆湯), “Xiao Qing Long Jia Shi Gao Tang” (小青龍加石膏湯), and others. It doesn’t mean that one of the herbal remedies should be selected to treat a patient directly. Instead, the TCM Theory used these herbal remedies to teach its practitioners how to “think” and create a proper herbal remedy based on the conditions of a specific patient.
For example, the Coronavirus has quite a puzzling situation that many Western medicine doctors haven’t yet fully understood. Some severely affected patients exhibited fibrosis of the lung like the SARS phenomenon. Other severely affected patients did not have SARS-like lung fibrosis but had massive liquid cumulated in the lung, which even “drown” some patients to death. From the TCM point of view, it is not strange at all. Fibrosis of the lung is the typical following stage of Heated Interior matching to “Da Qing Long Tang” (大青龍湯). It was named as “Lung Atrophy” (肺痿) in the TCM theory. And the situation that one suffers from massive dense liquid accumulation is matched to symptoms of severe development after the stages matched to “She Gan Ma Hung Tang”( 射干麻黃湯) , “Ting Li Da Zao Xie Fei Tang” (葶藶大棗瀉肺湯), and others as discussed earlier. The TCM theory called it “Lung Abscess” (肺癰). In the TCM theory, Lung Atrophy and Lung Abscess are two progression paths of this virus depending on which path develops faster or even simultaneously. From the past and current reports, SARS virus tilts toward the path of Lung Atrophy, while the Coronavirus tilts a little more toward Lung Abscess.
The above explained the progression of flu and other epidemic virus infections. Now you might understand how different TCM doctors had different views or treatment methods, but all of the treatments had some partially positive effects. If a TCM doctor’s diagnosis at one particular moment was slight hotness of the lung, some mild herbs to “clean up the heat” (清熱解毒輕劑), often used by the “Southern School” doctrine (溫病派), might relieve the patient’s symptoms. But if a TCM doctor’s diagnosis at a different point of the progression was massive mucus accumulation, heavy dosage of strong herbs, often used by the “Northern or Classic School” doctrine (經方派) might be needed to treat Lung Abscess (肺癰). That is why we saw some reports that the “Pneumonia Formula One” (肺炎一號) used in Guangzhou city, which was based on mild herbs to reducing the “heat”, had some positive effects in Guangzhou but not so effective in Shanghai. In Shanghai, many TCM doctors had to switch to stronger herbal ingredient often found in “Da Qing Long Tang” (大青龍湯) and “She Gan Ma Hung Tang”( 射干麻黃湯) as discussed earlier. This was due to different weather patterns and different patients, i.e. different progression paths described in the previous paragraphs. In other words, from the specific moment of the doctor’s diagnosis, both views were correct. But neither of them grasped the progression timeline of this severe illness.
Another point raised earlier was why did some patients fully recover while others did not? According to the information given by the doctors on the front line, there were so-called “Western medicine and TCM combined treatments” in which Western medicine drugs were continuously given to the patients and TCM herbs were used as supplements. When adding TCM herbs had a positive effect and made a speedier recovery, it was all goodness. But when adding TCM herbs did not have positive results, then what? According to the doctors on the front line, the medical team did not really think through the stages of disease progression as discussed earlier and switch to different TCM remedies, but only increased the dosage of Western medicine drugs such as Interferon (干擾素), Chloroquine phosphate (磷酸氯喹) used to treat malaria (抗瘧疾藥物), Arbidol (阿比多爾) used to treat influenza (抗流感藥物), and others. Heavy dosages of such drugs had severe side effects and sequelae. In those “combined” treatments, the medical teams didn’t have enough TCM expertise to make sound decisions on herbal remedies. Instead, they simply used TCM herbs as “extra help”.
How about treatments primarily with TCM remedies? The chief Western medicine expert who leads the fight against the Coronavirus, Dr. Nanshan Zhong, admitted under political pressure that TCM was useful against light or even medium threat situations of Coronavirus but insisted that TCM could not cure severe cases. His statement was based on his belief that there is no ingredient in TCM herbs that could kill Coronavirus. I am sorry to say that Dr. Zhong is incorrect in this aspect. With solid patient cases as proof, TCM can actually cure severe cases of Coronavirus infection and other flu-related infections. When it did not, it is the particular TCM doctors who had not mastered the whole theory and methodology of TCM. But one thing that Dr. Zhong said correctly was that no ingredient in TCM herbs can “kill” the virus. However, the TCM treatment isn’t based on the ability to kill the virus. (Translator’s note: Western medicine drugs could not kill the virus either.) Many people still have the level of limited understanding that TCM can only improve the immunization ability or some herbs such as the root of Isatis tinctoria (板藍根) has some natural antibiotic chemicals. Such understanding is unfortunately poor and very limited. Although modern medical science still could not fully comprehend TCM theory and its clinical outcome, against Coronavirus, the better explanation is that TCM remedies can “improve the internal environment of the human body”. (Translator’s note: So that the patient would not fall into the adverse conditions that the organs fail to function.) In plain words, when the virus causes more mucus, TCM remedies reduce the mucus. When the virus causes fibrosis, TCM remedies reduce the “heat level” of the lung. TCM remedies tend to push the body and organs back to the original healthy states. Once the environment is unfriendly for the virus to keep replicating, the patients will have higher chances to eradicate the virus by themselves and recover. One can probably say that this explanation and method is similar to the idea of using Western medicine Interferon but without severe side effects. That is, TCM can cure not because it has the ability to “kill” virus by some ingredients but to help to restore patients’ “internal environment” to healthier conditions that prevent the virus from replicating quickly. (Translator’s note: If one buys the same argument made by Dr. Zhong that a medication needs to have ingredients to kill the Coronavirus, then all the medications used today would not qualify. Then do we give up? In fact, why TCM was not selected to treat severe cases was because those stronger and less commonly used herbs were not applied properly or the TCM doctors at hand had less confidence for doing so. )
Now, we can go back to discuss how clinically TCM can treat and cure Coronavirus patients. For light to mild cases, most of the different TCM treatment methodologies could help. For medium to severe cases, as I discussed in my previous essay, we need to utilize the strength of certain herbs:
- Sheng Shi Gao (Gypsum, 生石膏): To reduce heat inside the lung (清肺熱) and enhance the liquid circulation in the respiratory system (加強肺津液運作)
- She Gan (Belamcanda chinensis, 射干)、Zi Wan (Aster tataricus, 紫菀) 、Kuan Dong Hua (Tussilago farfara flower, 款冬花)、Sheng Ban Xia (Pinellia ternate, 生半夏)、Ting Li (Sisymbrium indicum, 葶藶)、Da Ji (Euphorbia pekinensis Rupr., 大戟), etc.: To reduce accumulation of excessive mucus and wasteful fluids inside the respiratory system (去肺下方濃稠痰飲、肺積水、胸腔積液等)
- Ma Huang (Ephedra sinica Stapf., 麻黃), etc.: To enhance the lung function (宣肺、發陽)
- Mai Men Dong (Ophiopogon japonicas, 麥門冬)、Xing Ren (Prunus armeniaca, 杏仁): To moisturize the lung (潤肺)
That is, we need to combine the theory and targeted responses of the various herbal remedies such as “Da Qing Long Tang” (大青龍湯), “She Gan Ma Hung Tang” (射干麻黃湯) , “Ting Li Da Zao Xie Fei Tang” (葶藶大棗瀉肺湯), ”Ze Qi Tang” (澤漆湯)“, etc. as discussed earlier, and properly adjust the dosages and ratios of ingredients to fit the requirements of individual patients based on their conditions. In addition, if the patients have other ailments, those conditions need to be taken into account also, such as:
- For “Coldness and Wetness of the Middle and Lower Abdomen“ (中下焦寒濕) or “Deficient Kidney Function” (腎陽不足): Add Bao Fu Zi (processed Aconitum carmichaelii Debx root, 炮附子)、Xi Xin (Asarum sieboldii, 細辛), etc.
- When the liver function is weak or damaged by heavy dosages of Western medicine drugs such as interferon: Add Chai Hu (Bupleuri Radix, 柴胡)、Huang Qin (Scutellaria baicalnsis Geprgi root, 黃芩), etc.
There is no question that it is very challenging to fight off the Coronavirus. The clinical treatments will seriously test TCM doctors’ thorough understanding of TCM and their ability and courage to call the right shots under a great amount of pressure. On the other hand, it is also a good time to prove that TCM can be effectively used to fight various viruses in a superb and speedy fashion with little sequelae and at a much lower cost.
For fighting such a new and aggressive virus epidemic, there is no single TCM herbal formula that can treat all situations. One must have deep knowledge of the stages of the disease, along with close examinations on patients’ preconditions, so one can use the most effective prescription to intercept and turn the symptoms around. On the other hand, many provinces and cities in China provided TCM guidelines on Coronavirus treatments and pre-fixed herbal formulas to address people’s demands on a herbal remedy for “common usage”. Among them, I found the current recommendation from the Chinese National TCM Administration the most appropriate for a good percentage of Coronavirus patients. The herbal remedy was recently named as “Qing Fei Pai Du Tang” (清肺排毒湯), which could probably be translated to “clean up the lung and get rid of the toxic”. In line with the discussion above, this specific herbal formula includes Ma Huang (Ephedra sinica Stapf., 麻黃), Zhi Gan Cao (processed Glycyrrhiza uralensis Fisch., 炙甘草)、Xing Ren (Prunus armeniaca, 杏仁)、Sheng Shi Gao (Gypsum, 生石膏)、Gui Zhi (Ramulus Cinnamom, 桂枝)、Ze Xie (Alisma orientalis, 澤瀉)、Zhu Ling (Polyporus umbellatus, 豬苓)、Bai Zhu (Atractylodes macrocephala Koidz., 白朮)、Fu Ling (Poria, 茯苓)、Chai Hu (Bupleuri Radix, 柴胡)、Huang Qin (Scutellaria baicalnsis Geprgi root, 黃芩)、Jiang Ban Xia (Pinellia ternate, 薑半夏)、Sheng Jiang (Ginger, 生薑)、Zi Wan (Aster tataricus, 紫菀)、Kuan Dong Hua (Tussilago farfara flower, 款冬花)、She Gan (Belamcanda chinensis, 射干)、Xi Xin (Asarum sieboldii, 細辛)、Shan Yao (Dioscorea oppositifolia, 山药)、Zhi Shi (Citrus aurantium, 枳實)、Chen Pi (Citrus reticulata Blanco, 陳皮)、and Huo Xiang (Pogostemon cabin, 藿香). Since such an herbal remedy was designed for “common usage”, it has to consider all degrees of disease severity. Therefore, the dosages can’t be too heavy, as the majority of the patient cases are light to mild. As the result, “Da Qing Long Tang” (大青龍湯) discussed earlier became a lighter herbal formula named as “Ma Xing Gan Shi Tang” (麻杏甘石湯). The stronger herbal ingredients such as Ting Li (Sisymbrium indicum, 葶藶) and Da Ji (Euphorbia pekinensis Rupr., 大戟) to treat pleural effusion and hydronephrosis are not included. Hence, for severe cases, the herbal remedy from the Chinese National TCM Administration needs to be enhanced with additional ingredients and larger dosages.
In summary, as long as the TCM doctors have sufficient knowledge and clinical experience, by applying the proper methodology, TCM alone is capable of dealing with severe Coronavirus infections. (Translator’s note: There is much to do to develop a comprehensive diagnostic and treatment methodology which can help many TCM doctors to pinpoint the patient’s condition and stages of the infection to make the proper decision, especially when fully qualified TCM doctors are of short supply.) At this moment, there is no “special drug” in Western medicine to cure Coronavirus, but to resort to cortisone, antibiotics, interferon, anti-malaria, anti-flu drugs to maintain the lives of patients and passively wait and hope that the patients’ bodies can find their own way to turn the situation around. Even then, the Western medicine drugs mentioned above all potentially have significant side effects and sequelae. Patients with severe cases might be able to get out of the deathbed but most likely live with some permanent damages to the body. Dr. Zhong, China’s chief Western medicine expert on the Coronavirus epidemic, also warned that the current path of developing the “special drug” would most likely lead to severe sequelae to the patients. Given that is the case, why don’t we put much more effort to fully develop the TCM treatment of viral infection, not just for Coronavirus but also for future viruses which will bound to happen in the future?
(Translator’s note: As China is getting good control of the virus spread and gradually recovers from this epidemic, the knowledge learned will be invaluable to the rest of the world. Europe and the United States are on the exponential rise of new cases as of the writing on 3/14/2020. Various models predict that in the US alone Coronavirus infections can reach millions, as discussed in the Opinion Column of New York Times, “How Much Worse the Coronavirus Could Get, in Charts” by Nicholas Kristof and Stuart A. Thompson, March 13, 2020. China should continue to put efforts to develop TCM diagnostic and treatment methodology so that millions of people in the rest of the world can be helped and saved. TCM is not just for science, it is for humanity.)
(http://andylee.pro/wp/?p=7729)
#當張仲景遇上史丹佛
同時也有2部Youtube影片,追蹤數超過8萬的網紅賭Sir【杜氏數學】HermanToMath,也在其Youtube影片中提到,杜氏數學 官方網站: http://www.HermanToMath.com 賭Sir 幫你急救 DSE 數學: https://HermanToMath.skx.io ---------- ?️賭Sir是杜氏數學Herman To Math的始創人 ?全港唯一「完爆」【DSE Core+...
「point to distance formula」的推薦目錄:
point to distance formula 在 半瓶醋 Facebook 的最讚貼文
"橫尾先生你傾向於在你的遊戲中有個悲傷的結局(除了《尼爾 自動人形》),這是為什麼呢?
橫尾:我想啊,玩家在遊戲中的旅程中殺了那麼多的敵人,但自己卻迎來了一個Happy Ending,這很奇怪,所以我之前遊戲的主角都有著不幸的結局,我覺得對他們來說有個Happy Ending是不對的。
不過對《尼爾 自動人形》來說,對2B和9S來說,從被給予生命,他們殺了很多人,但也被自己殺了很多,很多次,有著無數次的輪迴。我認為這已經把他們殺死敵人的罪給贖了,幸福結局對他們兩個來說更合適一些。"
【尼爾:自動人形】是好遊戲,2B很可愛~
Talking To Yoko Taro, PlatinumGames' Takahisa Taura, And Composer Keiichi Okabe About Life, Death, And Opportunity
This interview with《Nier: Automata》director Yoko Taro and PlatinumGames' designer Takahisa Taura was first conducted in March of this year. Square Enix then offered gameinformer another chance to talk with Taro again, this time with Keiichi Okabe to speak more about the game's creation, music, and design philosophies and we are taking this opportunity to combine both until-now unpublished interviews together.
At the start of the first interview, Taro Yoko, whose pen name is appropriately Yoko Taro, was surprisingly quiet. He took a gulp from a bottle of Diet Pepsi and looked me straight in the eye to say something. I myself looked to the translator, who laughed at whatever Yoko said. She began "Yoko-san wants you to write about how expensive the food and drinks are here, if you can. He says it's way too much."
[The following interview contains some spoilers for Nier: Automata, including the game's final ending.]
With Nier: Automata, you guys won a Game Developer Conference award. How do you feel about that?
Yoko: We heard it was a user's choice award where the players themselves select the winners, so I'm just really happy that the players have selected our game for winning the award.
How did PlatinumGames and Yoko-san first meet on Nier? Why did you decide on that project versus something like another Drakengard or a new IP as a whole?
Taura: I loved the previous Nier title, I was actually went to Square Enix saying "Please let us create a Nier sequel, because you haven't done anything with it for a long time." At the same time, there was coincidentally Saito-san, the producer for Nier: Automata, talking with Yoko-san that they wanted to do something together. It just so happened that it was the right time, right place and we met for the first time when we started this project.
When you started working on the Automata, did you know what it was going to be? Did you have an idea in your head of what a Nier sequel would look like after the first game?
Yoko: Not at all, I had no ideas for a sequel in mind. When I first heard that we might do a collaboration with PlatinumGames, the image I had of them is that they only create Sci-Fi action games. When I thought of that, I thought of what part of the Nier storyline might fit in with that Sci-Fi action gaming sequence, I selected the themes for Automata because I felt it just fits in with the PlatinumGames style.
PlatinumGames has a reputation for fast, often-challenging action games, but Nier: Automata is a lot easier. Was that intentional to keep it closer to the first Nier or perhaps a consequence of trying to make PlatinumGames action more mainstream?
Taura: That's actually exactly the reason why. Saito-san from Square Enix told us when the project started that, since the original Nier has a lot of female fans and a lot of non-action gamer fans, to make the game as fun and accessible as possible to people who aren't accustomed to playing difficult action games. We always thought of making the game into something that's fun to play for newcomers to the action game field, but also to the more experienced players as well.
One of the usual tropes of PlatinumGames is that, as the game goes on, it tends to escalate more and more to an explosive finale. Nier: Automata kind of messes with that formula a little bit by Ending A being a little bit more subdued and low-key and then goes up again and again until it finishes with endings D and E. Is that something you had to work with Yoko-san about, where the escalation and pacing would best fit the gameplay?
Taura: In terms of like a climax or increasing the difficulty level toward the end, it's not that different from our other titles, or at least we didn't feel like it was that different. The one major difference was that this was the first game that I've at least worked that had the leveling up element in it. So as long as you level up your character, the boss would be easier to defeat, but if you don't, then some of the enemies toward the end of the game would be very difficult. For me, the balancing between the difficulty level of stages and bosses versus the levels the player might be was the difficult part in creating this game.
One thing that we really had it easy with in this game is that Yoko-san's scenario and Okabe-san's music, once it's mixed into the battle, makes a really menial and indifferent battle sequence suddenly becomes this dramatic and grandiose battle with everything at stake, so I felt like that really helped elevate our battle sequences as well. We did have an easy time thanks to that!
With Automata, you started appearing at press conferences and as part of the marketing of the game, whereas previously you never did that. When you appear in public, you have been wearing a mask of Emil from the first Nier title. Why Emil specifically?
Yoko: Hmm. One of the answers I can give is that, and I do have a little more that I want to elaborate on, is that for one Emil in the previous title is just a strong character on its own, so it's more like an iconic image or character for Nier as a series. Another part of the answer is that Emil actually holds a great secret of the part of the Nier world and it's not all revealed with the games I've created so far. I'm not sure if I'll have an opportunity to disclose that secret, but if I do, I might one day create a game that delves more into why it's Emil and why I continue to wear Emil's mask.
I don't know if either of you can speak to this, but the trailers for Nier: Automata were a little misleading. They showed A2, who you play as late in the game, but with short hair, so she looked like 2B. Was that something you decided, to show those scenes but not make it clear who it was?
Yoko: There were trailers like that?
There was one specifically showing A2 fighting Hegel like that.
Yoko: Ahh, yeah. There's no reason! We weren't trying to hide A2 or mislead anyone, it just happened to work out that way.
Taura: We made so many trailers at some point we kind of didn't care what we showed.
Oh, wow, that's going to shock a lot of fans in the Nier community. People really believed in the theory that you were hiding A2 in plain sight the marketing.
Yoko: Haha, but it might not be the correct answer. Like Taura-san said, we made so many trailers that we can't remember them all, so I'm definitely happy to take the credit without remembering why.
Taura: Yeah, let's say we intentionally did that. For the fans. It might be true.
Yoko: But I can say, in one of the trailers is A2 fighting one of the Engels, one of the big robots. She actually has long hair in the trailer, but in the actual game, it's after she cut her, so she would have had shorter hair. That one was actually intentional, because we did not reveal before the game that A2 would cut her hair, so we actually made a scene specifically with long-haired A2 to take that trailer. So that's that shot was kind of a lie.
In the Automata DLC, the CEO of Square Enix Yosuke Matsuda, as well as PlatinumGames boss Kenichi Sato, are boss fights. Where did that idea come from and how did you get them to approve it? How did they react when you asked them?
Yoko: Haha, oh yeah.
Taura: The development team went to Square Enix and said "Please let us use him in our game!" Their reaction was initially saying "Uhm, are you sure you want to?"
We were thinking for a while of what we could do with the DLC, because we didn't have a lot of time to develop it, so we wanted to do something fun with it. When we were thinking about it, we saw that Final Fantasy XV used a character model of president Matsuda in one of their marketing assets. When Yoko-san saw that, he reached out and asked if maybe we could use that in the game at Platinum. We said that, if we get the character models, we could definitely use them for something in the game. We reached out to Square Enix and they gave us the model and we were able to use that character model for a boss fight.
If it was just that you were able to fight the CEO of Square Enix, then it would have just been the same as what Final Fantasy XV did, so we had to think of ways to spice that up even more. So we had PlatinumGames' CEO Sato-san appear in the fight as well. We also included background music that arranged their voices, we included their voices in the music, just to add a little bit more and beat out Final Fantasy XV. That BGM track is Matsuda-san and Sato-san's debut single. We didn't even get permission from them, so it's an unofficial debut single, and those are much rarer.
Speaking of crossovers, did you know that Nier fans have been trying get Katsuhiro Harada of Bandai Namco to put 2B in Tekken? Is that something you guys would want to do? [Note: This interview was conducted before 2B was announced as a Soulcalibur guest character.]
Yoko: For us, if we were asked, we would gladly say yes to anything for money. We're open to any kind of opportunities for anything, ever. Even if it's Candy Crush, if they want to use 2B, we will say yes, please go ahead and use her.
Actually, speaking of doing anything for money, you've never created a direct story sequel before, they've all been loosely tied together and many years apart. Saito-san has already said there will be another Nier game, if the characters are popular enough, would you create a direct sequel to Automata or would you change the characters and location again?
Yoko: I haven't thought about it once! Taura-san, where would you want to create a new game?
Taura: Actually, when I brought my concept document to Square Enix about a Nier sequel, I wanted to write a story about that prologue portion in the first Nier game. You know the beginning of the game, where you're kind of in Tokyo, in an area that's more modern? I kind of want to delve into that storyline a little bit more. So if I'm allowed to create a new Nier title, that's what I want to create. But that's just me speaking as a fan of the series, so I don't think that will actually happen officially.
Yoko: When I actually heard about that idea from Taura-san when we first started this project, I felt that it would be very difficult to make a modern recreation of Tokyo because it's the city that we constantly see every day. You just notice differences in the lies that we put in there, so I felt it would be very difficult to do to recreate a city that we know and see so much. But now that I know that PlatinumGames is such a good studio that they most likely will have that power and talent to be able to create that kind of video game world, I think that might be an option. Whether or not we'll do that is a different question, but it is a viable option.
One of the things you said before the release of Drakengard 3 was that you wanted to call it Drakengard 4 and just let people figure out what the theoretical Drakengard 3 was supposed to be. That's similar to what you did with Automata where the game takes place 10,000 years after Nier and people who played the first game were more confused than new players. Was that an intentional idea or something you've wanted to do for a while?
Yoko: It's not that I brought over that idea to Nier: Automata, the greatest reasoning why I did this is because I wanted players who haven't played the original title to enjoy Nier: Automata so you can enjoy the game without knowing anything about the previous game. That's the biggest reason why we took a storyline that's so far in the future that it really didn't have anything to do with the previous title.
A common through-line for Yoko-san's games is flowers: the lunar tear in the Nier series, the flower in Zero's eye in Drakengard 3, is that symbolizing anything in your games or is it just visual imagery you like?
Yoko: Well, I do like flowers in general, but yes, there is a greater meaning to it that I have with these flowers. It's the same as Emil like I talked about earlier, I just haven't revealed it anywhere. There is a meaning, which is why they keep on coming back in my games, but I haven't revealed it anywhere yet.
With the last Nier game, you had said that you built the game on the concept of people being okay with murdering people who are different. With Nier: Automata, the games actually became more fun to play and control and touch, do you think there's a danger in giving people that sense of ease in killing enemies in the narrative?
Yoko: In the previous title, I actually feel like I overdid that a bit. I did want to portray that enemies have a reason to live and a reason to fight on their own as well, but I feel like I forced that idea that I had in my mind a little bit too much on the players. So for Nier: Automata, I did not want to focus on it, I didn't want to impose my feelings and thoughts. I actually feel that it's fine if some people feel it's fun to kill in our games. If that's all that they feel from the game, then it's fine, because its their freedom to feel what they want from the game. To answer your question, I think that it's fine to have that happen.
Taura: I actually have the same answer, too. I feel like if it's fun to fight, that's great as a game designer. But if you feel bad to kill these cute little robots, that's fine with me as well. I feel like different people will have different reactions to the game and they will feel differently when they play the game, so I'm actually happy to create a game that creates those kind of differences within the players as well.
Yoko: That's a really good question for us, because if players felt that it was way too fun to kill these enemies that it started making them feel guilty, that's something we didn't really aim to do. Just as we mentioned earlier, I'm really happy that players were able to take it on their own and experience it on their own, then we didn't just provide something for people to take it as-is on face value. I feel like it's great that the players are now taking the game and experiencing it on their own and trying to figure things out on their own.
There was a time after 2B was revealed that people were asking you about her design on Twitter and you answered that you just like sexy ladies. That quote has become pretty famous and attached to you and a lot of people are reading into it. Is that a thing you still believe, would you ever take the quote back, or would you have ever changed 2B's design?
Yoko: [laughs] Don't straight men like cute girls? Isn't that common knowledge? I didn't realize that was a quote.
A lot of people use you as an example as a developer that just says what is on their mind.
Yoko: Before we released the game, on Twitter, because so many people were sending me 2B fan art, I said that "Send me a zip file of all your erotic fan art!" When I tweeted that out, my number of Twitter followers jump from 20,000 to 60,000 just with that one Tweet. I actually think it's because I did something that's more of a taboo in the western world where I talked about sexuality or gender that openly on Twitter, but that's actually...so, I do know that what I said did not just creative positive buzz and there's some negative buzz around it as well, but I feel like it kind of has to do with the Japanese culture where we're not too strict about gender and sexuality and being more open about talking about those things.
I think it's the same thing as reading manga as an adult, it's a little bit different when you think about it because in Japan that's more common, it's not considered something weird or something outlandish. With that kind of feedback that I get from fans, I just feel like it's the difference in culture between Japan and the rest of the world.
That is something you tend to tackle fairly often. Drakengard 3 was partly about sex and sexuality treated casually within the game's universe, is that something you feel doesn't translate across all regions?
Yoko: I actually don't think [translating across regions] has a lot to do with sexuality. I don't think it would have sold more copies of Drakengard 3 if I took away aspects of sexuality or added more in there. I feel that Nier: Automata sold well because we worked with PlatinumGames, so I don't think that has anything to do with a sexual nature.
For the original Nier, there was a lot of information on the periphery of the game like books with background information and short stories that answer questions raised in the game. Automata even had a stage play predating the game. Do you think it's harder for western fans to grasp the whole stories of these games when there's Japanese-exclusive media about it expanding the lore?
Yoko: Of course we can't localize everything because we have limitations in budget, so it's really difficult to do all of that, but I actually think there really isn't a need to know everything, either. The meaning I have behind Emil's mask or the flowers you asked about, like I said it's not revealed in the game at all or anywhere else yet, but no one really needs to know that to enjoy the game or enjoy the world or enjoy the game. More than gaining knowledge, I want players to cherish the experience they have when playing the game. It's more about that instead of the knowledge they could have for every question. Of course the theatrical stage play was more of like a YoRHa spinoff, but you don't need to know that to enjoy the game. Every piece, like the books and the stage play, is made in a way so that you can enjoy it by yourself, so you don't need that extra knowledge to enjoy it.
It may add a little bit depth to the knowledge that you have, but you don't necessarily need to have it. I do understand the otaku mentality that you want to know everything, you want to have everything answered, you want to collect everything, but I don't see the value in knowing everything. For example, just in real life, you might not know everything about the politics that surrounds the world or even in your own country, and there's really no point in knowing everything that happens in the world. Maybe a lot things, but not everything, right? What's more important is how you interact with people around you, immediately around you, and I think that's the same with video games. You don't really need to know everything that happens in the world to enjoy it.
Of course I do respect the freedom that the players feel as well, so if you do get mad that we can't localize everything in America, or America never gets everything, that's also something to be respected and I do understand the frustrations surrounding that as well.
When Nier: Automata released, it did so in a three-month timeframe that several other big Japanese games came out in the U.S., like The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild and Yakuza 0. A lot of people started heralding those games as a return of Japanese development in the west. What do you think about going from fairly niche games to what some people consider the tip of the spear of modern Japanese development?
Yoko: First and foremost, just to speak about having so many good titles in that timeframe, my thought was "Are you people trying to kill me with this?!" In Japan, Horizon came out first, then it was Nier, then Zelda, and I think in the west, it was Horizon, Zelda, then Nier in North America. So we're literally sandwiched between those two with a two-week window in between each and they were all very similar to us in the futuristic setting. Especially for Zelda, it was one of the titles we copied in the first place, so I really felt like they were trying to kill us at the time.
Personally, not even thinking about Nier: Automata during that time frame, I was running around excited about all the fun-looking games coming as a gamer myself.
Hideki Kamiya [PlatinumGames] has once said that Nier: Automata saved Platinum. Is that something you agree with and how has the relationship been between PlatinumGames and Square Enix?
Yoko: Speaking from my perspective, of course Taura-san will likely know more about it internally at PlatinumGames...Kamiya-san, he's very laid back on Twitter, but when you actually really talk to him, he's a very serious person and very sincere. I guess Nier: Automata did generate sales for them, because I received a direct letter of gratitude from him saying "Thank you very much for creating a great game." I don't even know if we saved them or not in that sense, but just receiving that kind of message from was just very heartwarming and I was just really happy that I was able to provide such a game for them.
Taura: You could make the headline of your article "Yoko Taro Saved PlatinumGames" and that's definitely true.
Yoko: It's a very true headline.
Why do both of you think that Nier: Automata was more successful than Yoko-san's previous games or most other PlatinumGames titles?
Taura: Mainly because PlatinumGames' sensibilities were much better than Yoko Taro's.
Yoko: I actually think it's the Square Enix brand, the name Square Enix gives a more reliable feeling to an otaku type of title. PlatinumGames' strong name being known for making really good action games and I think the combination of the two really helped. This time with Nier: Automata, we sold about 2.5 million copies and the previous title we sold around 500,000. For the last game, we weren't really in the red, but it wasn't exactly a success either. We have these passionate fans that really supported the time from announcement and the series as a whole. Of course for Automata, too, we had a very passionate fan base including the media and including yourself that gave impressions and articles that helped make the game into a success, so I'm just really grateful for the fans and media alike that really supported the title and were passionate about it.
[The remainder of this interview took place a few weeks later with Taro Yoko and Nier: Automata composer Keiichi Okabe. Okabe is also known for his work on both Nier titles, Drakengard 3, Tekken, and contributing some tracks to Super Smash Bros. Ultimate. Before we started recording, Yoko said it will be okay if I asked Okabe most of the questions and I remarked that I wouldn’t want to make him jealous. He paused for a moment and then said it doesn’t matter because he would get paid either way.]
You two have been working together for a long time, I was curious how much the music composition is tied in with the writing. One of the city themes in Nier: Automata uses similar composition to a track in Nier. Does that come from the writing or the musical identity of the series?
Okabe: Since Yoko-san is I feel the type of person that doesn't want to do the same thing over and over again, even if he did receive praise for what he did previously, I kept that in mind while I was composing music for Nier: Automata. I also wanted to have some kind of connection that you would feel as a player between the previous title and this one, so I used similar tones from previous titles or from the previous game. It might not be exactly the same, but I used some similar types of music lines from the previous title so that you might feel that kind of connection.
But we do have tracks that are arrangements of previous tracks from older titles, but that was mostly for fan service.
I kind of wanted to drill down a little bit this time and get to the core of your philosophy of why and how you make games. If you had to pick a reason to hold up and say "This is why I make video games," what would that be?
Yoko: I feel that video games, amongst all the different entertainment mediums, have the most freedom in what you can do as a creator. For example, in a film, if you are able to control movement, then that's no longer a film in my eyes. In video games, you could have film-like cutscenes and videos, you could have them going on forever as much as you would like as a creator. That kind of freedom to do that is what I really wanted to do and I feel like video games are what provide me that option, even if I never do it.
Is there any kind of message you use games for that you want to convey to your audience or anything you want them to hear from you? Or do you prefer to let them take whatever interpretation they get from your games?
Yoko: It's the latter. I would want our players to freely interpret what I've created just on their own, to grasp something for their own. I feel that's one of the interesting aspects of video games is that you are able to freely interpret what's being shown to you. I also feel like the players make the game whole by playing it. The action of playing the game I feel has meaning in itself and because of that I want the players to find something from the game, feel something from the game, for themselves.
Nier: Automata won a number of awards, Okabe-san you won best music at The Game Awards, Automata won the audience award at GDC. Is there any pressure to appeal a more mainstream audience with your next game?
Okabe: For a popular title that will be played by many, it doesn't really matter what kind of genre you put out musically. I will still be interested to compose music for those if possible. I would have to take a different approaches to those kind of mainline titles, whereas for Nier, I felt that the music can be more geared toward a core audience where only those who would understand the music would play it. But at the same time, once you understand, I want you to be deeply affected by it. That's what I aim for with Nier. If I am to work on a way more mainstream title next time, I will have to change that mindset I have as a composer, but that would be something I'd like to challenge myself more. To answer your question, yes, I'd like to try that, but I'd also do whatever kind of jobs I'm assigned to.
Yoko: For me, my games I actually think are really niche. How Nier: Automata was so successful was actually just a coincidence. To make a successful game is something that I can't really aim to do, so I think that I'll probably return to my small and dark corner, my niche corner, with my successive titles.
Who would you both consider your inspirations for writing and composing?
Okabe: For me, it's obviously more of a composer than a writer, but I don't really focus on one person. I tend to just try to get music here and there and have a wide net. I am greatly affected by people who I've listened to in my youth, like Japanese composer Ryuchi Sakamoto, Ennio Morricone who creates film music, and also pop music like Michael Jackson and Madonna. I am affected by those as well.
Yoko: I have received inspiration from a lot of things, but I think personally expressions in film or any like visual production is something I'm deeply affected by. For example, Neon Genesis Evangelion by Hideaki Anno, that was really a strong influence on me. Also, the drama series 24, the way that they incorporate speedy and complicated constructions of storylines was something that was very new at the time. Just throughout the timeline of visual production, I think there's a sudden burst of evolution, and I think that "that" moment in a title that does that just greatly affects me and becomes an inspiration for me. But I feel that can be said for the rest of the world.
Lately, anything that Christopher Nolan creates I think is very intriguing where he tries to include deep knowledge and thoughtfulness into what he creates. I'm very interested in this new wave of evolution.
Last year, with the release of Animal Crossing on mobile, you talked on social media about how it was your favorite game of the year because you created a narrative where the characters were all unwillingly imprisoned in the camp. Do you often create your own narratives for games?
Yoko: I do that for some games and I don't for others. Off and on, I guess. It's a lot easier to create my own storyline per se for a more primitive game. For example, in Zelda: Wind Waker, you start off with a grandma and your sister living on an island and it's really happy and joyful and there's really no reason for Link to get out of there and fight Ganondorf because you're already living happily. You don't need to get out of that happiness. As a gamer, I felt the kind of sadness to have to leave that happy island life.
In Dragon Quest [V], you have to choose who you want to wed, and I felt that I couldn't really get into liking either of the characters. I also couldn't find the point of having to decide who I want to marry, so I just at that instant I turned off the game and said "My journey ends here!" My mind narrated "The three of them went on the journey and lived happily ever after, the end." That was my ending for Dragon Quest V.
Around the release of Drakengard 3, you spoke about how it's not possible in this industry to make a six-minute game and sell it for $60, no matter how good those six minutes are. Is this something you still think?
Yoko: That analogy was given to explain that, no matter how much you try to make a game really good, there's a limit to what you can do. If you are to create a six-minute game, because you can't go through a lot of different stages, you would have to create one stage. Which means that you could really refine the quality of that one stage without having to put in a lot of money into it and a lot of manpower into it. Also, because it's only six minutes, you can't really have too many characters in it, so you could focus on one or two characters at max. By doing that, you could refine the quality of those two characters. But because you're time-limited, no matter how much you refine the quality of the world around you or the characters, if you're limited to six minutes there's just so much you could do that the game won't become good at all. That was an example for me to say that there's a limit to what you can do in video games.
Okabe-san, in the music for a lot of Yoko-san's game, you use constructed or uncommon languages, is there a specific reason for that?
Okabe: [laughs] Yeah, for one, because it is Nier: Automata, Replicant, and Gestalt, they all take place in a unique world, even though they're in the timeline of our current world, it's so much in the future that it should feel kind of foreign. That's one of the reasons why I went for language we can't understand, but another is that, in games in the past, game directors actually got mad at many occasions for including vocals into the soundtrack. They were saying that it would become too distracting from the gameplay and would distract the player. It was considered more of a taboo, so for Nier, I included vocals in there without a language you could understand more for the sound that you get from the words. It wasn't to convey any meaning of what was being said, but more for a sound impact.
Yoko-san, you tend to have very sad endings in your games, with the exception of Nier: Automata which is as happy an ending as you can get with most characters dying. Why do you tend to write toward more sad endings and do you feel like Automata's happy ending fit the game better?
Yoko: The reason why I created endings that end on a death is because, until now I was creating games where you would kill a lot of enemies, but I've always felt that it doesn't feel right when the protagonist has a happy after they've killed so many enemies during the course of their journey. That's why in Replicant and Gestalt, or my previous titles, the protagonist pretty much ended up dying because I didn't feel like it was right for them to have a happy ending. But for Nier: Automata, 2B and 9S, from the time that they were given life, they've been killing a lot of enemies, but they've also been killed by them many, many times, and regenerated many times. They've actually been killing each other, which you find out at the very end, many, many times as well. So I felt that kind of cleansed them of their sins for killing so many enemies, which made me feel that a happy ending was more fitting for those two.
Do you feel like that cycle of violence and death and the consequences of that are human nature?
Yoko: I think the reasons why we kill in video games do kind of shine light on what's kind of broken within humanity or humans in general. We want peace in the world, but we also enjoy killing others in video games, like shooting guns in video games. I think that's karma in a sense for humans, the way that video games grasp the true essence of humanity, whether or not that's what they were aiming to do.
Is there a series that you know, like Persona or Yakuza or anything like that, that either of you would want to work on?
Yoko: A series or anything?
It can be anything.
Yoko: Personally, it's not a Japanese title. I'd actually love to see how western titles are developed, because I have no insight into how they're made. There was a moment in time where I felt that it might be fun join a western development to see how things run. Of course there's the language barrier that would make it difficult for me to do that, but generally speaking I feel that western storytelling follows kind of a similar route for all the stories that western mediums create. I would feel it fascinating to find out why western games use certain flows and storyline arcs.
Okabe: I'm kind of a fanboy myself, so there is a part of me that wants to work on major titles like Dragon Quest. I feel that if I do work on those titles, the pressure of working such a known title would be just too big and because there is a part of me that really loves that series, I feel like I would try to skew my music in a way that would fit into that series instead of trying to create music that I think is good. I don't feel like I would be able to bring out the best quality in my music if I worked on those big titles, because of that pressure and because of the image I have of those titles in my mind. Currently, my want to work on those major titles and the part of me that's telling me I shouldn't do it are about equal.
Were either of you surprised by Nier: Automata's success?
Yoko: [in English] Oh yes.
Okabe: For me, I live in Tokyo and developer PlatinumGames live in Osaka, so we did have quite a distance in-between, like literal physical distance between us. From the moment that I created the music to when I was able to see it next, there was a big gap in time, so when I was able to my music in the game for the first time, the game was pretty close to finished, they were almost done with development. At that moment, I thought "Maybe this one might sell?" But at the same time, I didn't think it would become this big of a success, I always thought it might do better than the previous titles, but it was like a hunch that I didn't feel until this time in Yoko-san's titles. I did have some kind of a gut feeling that it might do well.
The last song of Automata, Weight of the World, had a chorus with the entire game's development staff at PlatinumGames and Square Enix singing along to encourage the player. Why did you decide on that for the final song of the game?
Okabe: I didn't remember this, I actually forgot about it for a while, but Yoko-san actually came to me telling me that he wanted a chorus at the end of the game pretty early on in the development process. I apparently made disgruntled face at him and did not remember why I even made that face or even that I made that face. After a while, I actually remember why I had such a reaction with the disgruntled face, because there's a couple of different types of choirs, but Yoko-san likes the more classical choir, so when he requested that he wanted a choir, I thought he wanted that classical type of choir at the last part of the game. At that moment, I thought "Well, that doesn't really fit in with the game plan, I don't really want to do that," which is why I had that expression on my face. After we talked about it, Yoko-san mentioned that wasn't really what he was going for, he said that because that last scene is all about all these different people helping you, he wanted everyone to sing, he wanted it to feel like everyone is singing there with you as you play.
When I thought about doing that, and I actually agreed that might be a good idea, because in Nier: Automata all the choir vocals that you hear in the game, it's actually recorded by a small group of singers, I just overlapped their voice so it sounds like a big choir. Because that last part of the game is more about you playing amongst a lot of people, I felt that taking that approach again of overlapping voices again would not really work. So I reached out to the dev teams because they were working on that part and I thought it would be a good idea to have them put themselves in the game as well. I also thought that they don't need to have a good voice, it's just to give that feeling that you're playing with all these developers.
Development teams from Square Enix, PlatinumGames, and also some composers from my company who didn't work on Nier: Automata are singing in it as well. There's also children of PlatinumGames developers and their family actually singing in it as well. That was the reasoning behind why we decided to do that at the end.
Has there ever been, in all your games you've made, an idea you had that you had to be talked out of?
Yoko: For the first Drakengard, I had an idea of [Japanese pop-star] Ayumi Hamasaki, like her character model, wearing all-silver spandex, like a giant version of her descending from the sky and you would fight against her by music. Everyone else on the staff shut it down. It does still leave that kind of music game essence kind of in there, but the part Ayumi Hamasaki comes out in silver spandex has been taken out.
Isn't that kind of similar to Drakengard 3's actual ending?
Yoko: Similar, but I actually wanted to go for something funny, or shockingly stupid. But no one would let me.
Source:
https://www.gameinformer.com/…/talking-to-yoko-taro-platinu…
point to distance formula 在 初夏的東港之櫻 Facebook 的最佳貼文
那個南方叫屏東
屏東的黑鮪魚好ㄘ(〃∀〃)
【2016,這就是台灣人想要的總統!】
「妳回北京以後,告訴他們,」蔡英文說:「台灣的下一任總統曾經為妳服務過。」
(“Go back to Beijing,” says Tsai, “and tell them you were served by the next President of Taiwan.”)
上面那段話,是這幾天來,最讓我感佩與震撼的一段話。那是蔡英文主席接受《TIME》雜誌專訪長文的結語,鏗鏘有力,也讓人無比動容...
2016,我希望我能有幸擁有這樣的總統,一股溫柔的力量,卻又充滿自信與霸氣,不慍不火、不卑不亢,而這正是台灣這個即將新生的島國,用來在世界永續立足,最需要的態度。
朋友們告訴我,昨天附上的《TIME》雜誌英漢對照翻譯文章,已經被下架了。對此,我真的感到非常遺憾。(更新消息:PTT貼文者並非原譯,因恐引起誤會而刪文。原譯文出自獨立記者Jessie Chen臉書,特此致謝。)
對於那篇連夜趕出的翻譯稿,也許不同立場的朋友,會有不同想法與批評。但對於譯者的熱心與用心,我只有發自內心的感激和敬佩。因此,我在網路上找到備份文章,再一次(無修改)分享給我的朋友們,需要的,就幫忙再傳播出去吧!
德不孤必有鄰,一位擅長漫畫的朋友,也默默傳了她關於那段「溫柔力量」談話的圖像詮釋。淡淡的畫風,彷彿原景重現,對我而言,那份感動,似乎又更深了一些...
有人以文字速譯向小英致敬、有人以圖像速寫向小英致敬──
而我,只能藉此臉書一角,向翻譯者、漫畫家,跟小英總統本人,獻上最誠心的祝福與感謝!
謝謝你們,讓台灣變成一個更好更美的地方。
──────────底下為英漢對照翻譯原文──────────
民進黨主席暨總統參選人蔡英文登上最新一期時代雜誌封面,標題是「她將可能領導華人世界唯一民主國家, She Could Lead The Only Chinese Democracy」。蔡主席是繼印度總理莫迪、印尼總統佐科威、韓國總統朴槿惠後,最新一位登上時代雜誌封面的亞洲領導人。
中英譯全文:
雜誌封面
She Could Lead the Only Chinese Democracy
And that makes Beijing nervous
她將可能領導華人世界唯一的民主國家
這讓北京感到緊張
目錄頁
Cover Story: Championing Taiwan
Presidential front runner Tsai Ing-wen wants to put the island’s interests first
封面故事:壯大台灣
總統大選領先者蔡英文要將台灣利益置於優先
內頁大標
‘The Next President Of Taiwan’
That’s how Tsai Ing-wen refers to herself. But will the island’s voters agree?
台灣的下一任總統
蔡英文是這樣認為。但是這座島嶼的選民會同意嗎?
內文
Emily Rauhala / 台北報導 Adam Ferguson / 攝影
Tsai Ing-wen is making breakfast. The presidential candidate cracks five eggs and lets them bubble with bacon in the pan. She stacks slices of thick, white toast. It’s a recipe adapted from British chef Jamie Oliver, but the ingredients, she can’t help but say, are pure Taiwan. The meat comes courtesy of Happy Pig, a farm near her spare but tasteful Taipei apartment, the bread from a neighborhood bakery. She offers me an orange. “Organic,” she says, in English. “And local, of course.”
蔡英文正在做早餐。這位總統候選人打了五個蛋,和著平底鍋裡面的培根一起吱吱作響,再把一片片白色的厚片土司疊起來。料理手法學自英國名廚傑米奧利佛(Jamie Oliver),但是她忍不住要說,烹調食材屬於最純粹的台灣原料。培根來自「快樂豬」農場,距離她那簡單卻有品味的公寓不遠,而麵包是從她家附近的烘培坊買來的。她遞了一顆橘子給我,用英文跟我說:「有機的!當然也是在地的。」
This is not an average breakfast for the 58-year-old lawyer turned politician running to become Taiwan’s next President—most days she grabs a coffee and books it to the car. But it is, in many ways, oh so Tsai. The Taipei-raised, U.S.- and U.K.-educated former negotiator wrote her doctoral thesis on international trade law. As a minister, party chair and presidential candidate (she narrowly lost to two-term incumbent Ma Ying-jeou in the 2012 race), Tsai gained a reputation for being wonky—the type who likes to debate protectionism over early-morning sips of black coffee or oolong tea.
對於這位58歲、從律師轉變成政治人物的總統候選人來說,這可不是她平常吃的早餐。她通常隨手抓一杯咖啡在車上喝。不過許多方面來說,這應該可以算是一貫的「蔡式」風格。這位在臺北長大、在英美留學過的談判專家,博士論文寫的是國際貿易法。在她當陸委 會主委、民進黨主席、總統候選人期間(她在2012年的總統大選中以些微差距輸給了馬英九總統),得到學院派的風評──她是那種喜歡在早上喝黑咖啡或烏龍茶時,跟你辯論保護主義的人。
Now, as the early front runner in Taiwan’s January 2016 presidential election, her vision for the island is proudly, defiantly, Taiwan-centric. Tsai says she would maintain the political status quo across the strait with China—essentially, both Taipei and Beijing agreeing to disagree as to which represents the one, true China, leaving the question of the island’s fate to the future. But Tsai wants to put Taiwan’s economy, development and culture first. While Ma and his government have pushed for new trade and tourism pacts with Beijing—China accounts for some 40% of Taiwan’s exports—Tsai aims to lessen the island’s dependence on the mainland by building global ties and championing local brands. “Taiwan needs a new model, ” she tells TIME.
現在,身為在2016年台灣總統大選中的領先者,蔡英文的願景充滿自信又堅定地強調以台灣為核心。蔡英文說她會維持兩岸的現狀──這指的是說臺北與北京彼此同意對於何者代表中國保留不同的認知(註明:這是時代雜誌記者的見解),並且把這個島嶼的命運留給未來決定。但,蔡英文想要將台灣的經濟、發展與文化置於首位。當馬英九和他的政府推動與中國的貿易及觀光協議時(中國占台灣出口的百分之四十),蔡英文希望加強與世界連結、扶植台灣品牌,以降低台灣對中國的依賴。她對時代雜誌說:「台灣需要一個新模式」。
Whether voters share her vision is a question that matters beyond Taipei. Taiwan is tiny, with a population of only 23 million, but its economy—powered by electronics, agriculture and tourism—ranks about mid-20s in the world by GDP size, with a GDP per capita about thrice that of China’s. Ceded by China’s Qing dynasty to Japan after the 1894–95 First Sino-Japanese War, colonized by Tokyo for half a century, then seized by Nationalist forces fleeing the Communists at the end of the Chinese civil war, Taiwan has long been a pawn in a regional great game. It is a linchpin for the U.S. in East Asia alongside Japan, South Korea and the Philippines, and, most important, it’s the only real democracy in the Chinese-speaking world.
“This election matters because it’s a window into democracy rooted in Chinese tradition,” says Lung Ying-tai, an author and social commentator who recently stepped down as Culture Minister. “Because of Taiwan, the world is able to envision a different China.”
台灣的選民是否同意她的願景,是一件擴及台北以外的事情。台灣的土地雖小,只有兩千三百萬的人口,但是經濟因電子業,農業以及觀光業的支,以國內生產毛額來說在世界排名第二十幾名。台灣的國內人均產值則是中國的三倍。台灣在1894-95的中日戰爭被中國清朝割讓後,被日本殖民了半個世紀;之後在中國內戰結束時逃避共產黨的國民黨勢力給佔領。長期以來台灣是區域競爭中的一個棋子。在美國的東亞布局中,台灣、日本、南韓及菲律賓同為最關鍵的環節。更重要的是,台灣是在華語世界中唯一一個真正的民主國家。甫卸任文化部長的作者與社會評論員龍應台表示:「這場選舉很重要,因為它提供了一個窗口,讓外界一探以中華文化為根基的民主……因為台灣,世界得以想像一個不一樣的中國。」
Taiwan’s politics irritate and befuddle Beijing. To the ruling Chinese Communist Party (CCP), Taiwan is the province that got away, a living, breathing, voting reminder of what could happen to China if the CCP loosens its grip on its periphery, from Tibet to Xinjiang to Hong Kong. Beijing is particularly wary of a change in government from Ma’s relatively China-friendly Kuomintang (KMT) to Tsai’s firmly China-skeptic Democratic Progressive Party (DPP). When Tsai ran for President in 2012, Beijing blasted her, without actually naming her, as a “troublemaker” and “splittist”—CCP-speak reserved for Dalai Lama–level foes. “A DPP government means uncertainty for cross-strait ties,” says Lin Gang, a Taiwan specialist at Shanghai Jiao Tong University’s School of International and Public Affairs.
台灣的政治讓北京感到惱怒又百思不解。對中國共產黨來說,台灣是一個逃走的省,也是對中國活生生的提醒──若中國鬆懈對於香港、西藏及新疆等非核心地區的掌控時,可能會發生的事。北京對於台灣的政權,由對中國相對友善的馬政府輪替到對中國保持疑慮的民進黨,抱持格外戒慎的態度。蔡英文在2012年參選總統的時候,北京雖然沒有指名道姓,卻明顯對她大肆抨擊,說她是一個「麻煩製造者」或「分裂主義者」——在共產黨的術語中,這些話專門達賴喇嘛這一層級的仇敵。任教於上海交通大學國際與公共關係學院的台灣事務專家林岡說:「民進黨政府代表的是兩岸關係的不確定性。」
To the U.S., which is bound by the Taiwan Relations Act to come to the island’ s aid if it’s attacked, Taiwan is a longtime friend and unofficial ally, though the strength of that friendship is being tested by China’s rise. Washington worries that Taiwan’s people, especially its youth, are growing warier of China, and that any conflict between the two might draw in the U.S.
“What this election has done is crystallize the changes, the shift in public opinion,” says Shelley Rigger, a Taiwan scholar at Davidson College in North Carolina and the author of Why Taiwan Matters. “I don’t think cross-strait relations are going to be easy going forward, and that’s not something U.S. policymakers want to hear.”
對美國來說,根據《台灣關係法》,在台灣受到武力攻擊的情況下,須協防台灣。台灣是美國長期友邦和非正式盟國,儘管兩國之間友誼的強度正受到中國崛起的考驗。華府擔心台灣人民,特別是年輕人,對於中國的警戒心逐漸提高,而兩者之間的衝突可能會把美國牽扯進來。著有《台灣為何重要》(Why Taiwan Matters)一書的美國北卡羅來那州戴維森大學(Davidson College)教授任雪麗(Shelley Rigger)說:「這場選舉讓所有的改變具體化,反映出民意板塊的移動……我不認為接下來的兩岸關係會更融洽,而這不是美國的政策制定者想要聽到的東西。」
The KMT has yet to formally nominate a candidate for the top job, but the favorite is Hung Hsiu-chu, the legislature’s female deputy speaker. Nicknamed ”little hot pepper” because of her diminutive stature and feisty manner, Hung, 67, would be a contrast to the more professorial Tsai should she get the KMT’s nod. “I don’t think [Tsai] is a strong opponent,” Hung tells TIME. Yet the DPP’s choice, who has already started pressing the flesh islandwide, is spirited too. “People have this vision of me as a conservative person, but I’m actually quite adventurous,” she says. And possessed of a sharp sense of humor—when I compliment her cooking, Tsai looks at me with mock exasperation: “I have a Ph.D., you know.”
國民黨雖然還未正式提名總統候選人,但目前最被看好的就是立法院副院長洪秀柱。因為身材嬌小與好戰性格而被封為「小辣椒」的洪秀柱(67歲),如果獲黨的提名,將與擁有學者形象的蔡英文,呈現顯著的對比。洪秀柱向時代記者表示:「我不認為蔡英文是一位強的對手」。然而,民進黨的候選人已經士氣高昂,在全台各地展開競選活動。蔡英文說:「有些人認為我是一個保守的人,但我其實是很愛冒險的」。她有一種犀利的幽默感──當我讚美她的廚藝時,她用搞笑的語氣假裝惱怒說:「我可是擁有博士學位的。」
Tsai grew up in a home on Taipei’s Zhongshan Road North, a street named after Taiwan’s symbolic father, Sun Yat-sen, the Chinese revolutionary who helped overthrow the Qing and co-founded the KMT. Her own father, an auto mechanic turned property developer, was of the Confucian kind: he encouraged her to study hard but also expected her, as the youngest daughter, to devote herself to his care. “I was not considered a kid that would be successful in my career,” says Tsai.
蔡英文在台北的中山北路長大,這條街是以革命推翻清朝、成立國民黨並視為國父的孫逸仙命名。她的父親是一位修車技師,後來成為土地開發商。他承襲了儒家思想,希望蔡英文要用功讀書,但也期許身為小女兒的蔡英文可以留在父親身邊照顧他。蔡英文說:「我小時候不是一個被認為未來會有成就的孩子。」
After attending university in Taiwan, she studied law at Cornell in New York because, she says, it seemed the place for a young woman who “wanted to have a revolutionary life.” From there she went to the London School of Economics, where she earned her Ph.D., also in law, in less than three years. “That pleased my father,” she says. When he called her home, she obliged, returning to Taiwan to teach and, in 1994, to enter government in a series of high- profile but mostly policy-oriented roles in the Fair Trade Commission, National Security Council and Mainland Affairs Council.
在台灣大學畢業後,她前往紐約州康乃爾大學研讀法律,因為她說,這是一個「想過革命性的生活」的年輕女子該去的地方。之後,她前往倫敦政治經濟學院攻讀法學博士,並且三年不到就獲得學位。她說:「這讓我父親很高興」。她遵從父親的意思返回台灣,先回大學教書並在1994年進入政府,出任公平交易委員會、國安會及陸委會等一系列重要的、政策導向的職位。
Even close supporters say Tsai was, and perhaps still is, an unlikely politician, especially for the DPP. Taiwan’s opposition party was forged in struggle and led by veterans of the democracy movement—a fight Tsai mostly missed. The Kaohsiung Incident in 1979—a human-rights rally that was violently broken up by security forces, galvanizing the democracy movement— took place while Tsai was overseas, cocooned in the ivory tower. If the archetypal DPP operative is a bare-knuckle street fighter, Tsai is an Olympic fencer—restrained and precise.
就連許多親近蔡英文的支持者都認為,蔡英文是一位非典型的政治人物,特別就民進黨而言。身為在野黨的民進黨,在台灣民主運動的奮鬥過程中焠煉而成,由民主運動的老兵所成立,這是一場蔡英文錯過的戰役。1979年高雄的美麗島事件,當一場人權遊行遭警政單位暴力驅散,而後來激勵了台灣的民主運動,蔡英文當時正在國外求學,受到象牙塔的庇護。若說民進黨的典型人物是赤手空拳的街頭鬥士,蔡英文則是一位奧林匹克級的劍術家:自我克制又精確到位。
She stepped into the spotlight in 2008, becoming party chair when the DPP found itself booted from office, with its chief Chen Shui-bian, the outgoing President, later convicted of corruption. While she possessed a deep knowledge of policy, Tsai did not then seem like a leader. “She used to sort of hide behind me when we went door to door,” recalls legislator Hsiao Bi-khim, a longtime colleague and friend. “People compared her to a lost bunny in the forest, with wolves surrounding, both from within the party and outside.
在2008年民進黨失去政權,而前總統陳水扁隨即遭貪汙罪起訴的時刻,蔡英文踏入了鎂光燈下,成為民進黨主席。雖然蔡英文對於政策擁有深度的瞭解,但當時她還不像一位領導人。長期以來是她同事與朋友的立法委員蕭美琴說「以前當我們挨家挨戶去拜訪時,她有點會躲在我身後」。「有些形容她為一個在森林裡迷路的兔子,被黨內與黨外的狼群包圍。」
After an unsuccessful 2010 mayoral bid, Tsai ran for, and also lost, the presidency in 2012. Jason Liu, a veteran DPP speechwriter, says now that the campaign did not “sell” Tsai well enough. The ideas were strong, but the delivery left “distance between her and the voters.” Ironically, it was not until her concession speech that Tsai seemed to connect emotionally with Taiwan’s citizens. “You may cry,” she told the tearful crowd. “But don’t lose heart.”
2010年,蔡英文參與市長選舉失利,在2012年也沒順利當選總統。民進黨資深文膽劉建忻表示,當時的競選總部對於「行銷」蔡英文這個概念,做得不夠好;雖然擁有許多好點子,但是執行上還是「讓選民感到有所距離」。諷刺地,一直到敗選感言,蔡英文才似乎與台灣人民產生情感上的連結。她對含著淚水的群眾表示:「你可以哭泣,但不能洩氣。」
A lot has changed since 2012. Eleven hours after making eggs, with a policy meeting, a cross-country train ride and a harbor tour behind her, Tsai is addressing a couple hundred students at a university in the southern city of Kaohsiung, a DPP stronghold. She’s in lecture mode, at ease, talking about her party’s economic plans: stronger regional links and a focus on innovation to support small businesses. “How many of you went to Taipei for the Sunflower protests?” she asks in Mandarin. At least a third raise their hands.
2012年之後的台灣,歷經了許多改變。蔡英文煎蛋後的11個小時後,歷經了一場政策會議、搭乘高鐵從北一路向南、緊接著進行高雄碼頭導覽。她抵達南台灣民進黨的重鎮高雄,向數百位大學生發表演說。她以一派輕鬆的授課模式,闡述著民進黨的經濟計畫:加強區域間的連結,並聚焦於支持創新的小型經濟。她用中文詢問在場學生「你們之中有多少人去台北參加過太陽花學運?」現場至少有三分之一的學生舉起了手。
Taiwan’s students were once seen as apathetic. But during spring last year, Taipei was swept up by thousands-strong demonstrations over a services pact with China. Student and civic groups worried that the deal could hurt Taiwan’s economy and leave it vulnerable to pressure from Beijing. They felt it was pushed through without adequate public scrutiny. The Sunflower Movement, as it came to be called after a florist donated bundles of the blooms, grew into a grassroots revolt, culminating in the March 18 storming of the legislature.
台灣的學生過去一度被視為相當冷漠。但是在去年的春天,台北市被數以千計的抗議者淹沒,反對與中國簽訂的服務貿易協議。學生與公民團體擔憂這個協議會傷害台灣經濟,讓台灣的經濟受制於中國壓力而變得脆弱。他們也認為,服貿協議的推動並沒有經過適當的公民審議。太陽花運動是民間累積的抗爭與不滿,在3月18日這天一舉衝進立法院,運動的稱號是由於抗爭期間一位花販捐贈了大量太陽花而因此命名。
The movement was grounded in questions of social justice. Since coming to power in 2008, Ma has argued that cross-strait commerce is the key to the island’s fortunes, signing 21 trade deals. Yet young people in particular wonder if the deals benefit only Big Business on both sides of the strait. They say rapprochement with Beijing has left them none the richer, and agonize over the high cost of housing, flat wages and the possibility of local jobs going to China. A sign during a protest outside the Presidential Palace on March 30 last year captured the mood: “We don’t have another Taiwan to sell.”
這個運動的主要訴求就是社會正義。自從國民黨2008年執政以來,簽訂了21個兩岸貿易協定,馬英九主張兩岸的商業往來是台灣最關鍵的財富來源。但是年輕人質疑這項論述,他們認為這些貿易協議只有兩岸的大財團獲利。他們說北京的和解政策並沒有讓年輕人變得富有,反而讓他們受困於高房價、停滯的薪資、以及在地工作機會可能流失到中國的可能性。在去年3月30日於總統府外的抗議中,有個標語最能捕捉整體的社會氛圍:「台灣只有一個,賣了就沒了!」
The emphasis on quality of life, and not just macro-indicators, is good news for Tsai. Her vision for a more economically independent Taiwan did not sway the electorate in 2012 but may now have stronger appeal. The KMT, bruised by the Sunflower protests and then battered by fed-up voters in midterm polls last fall, is trying to remake itself as a more populist party. Timothy Yang, a former Foreign Minister who is now vice president of the National Policy Foundation, the KMT’s think tank, says the party stands by its cross-strait record. But even Yang, a KMT stalwart, is keen to address the issue of equity:
“The benefits of this interaction with mainland China should be shared with the general public.”
台灣社會對於生活品質的重視,而非僅僅強調宏觀經濟指標,對蔡英文來說是件好事。她希望打造一個經濟上更加獨立的台灣,雖然這個理念在2012年並沒有說動選民,但,現在可能更有吸引力。國民黨在太陽花運動中受到重創,在去年秋天的期中選舉中又再度被選民以選票教訓。現在,國民黨試圖把自己再造成一個民粹的政黨。目前擔任國民黨智庫『國家政策基金會』副董事長的前外交部長楊進添先生受訪時說道,「國民黨堅持其兩岸的立場」。但即便像楊進添這樣堅定的國民黨員,也熱衷於解決公平的議題。他說:「兩岸互動的利益,應該要與全民共享!」
Tsai should easily carry traditional DPP support: much of the south, the youth vote, and those who identify as Taiwanese and who are not a part of the elite that came from China after the CCP victory in 1949. The DPP’s missing link is Big Business, which supports the KMT and closer ties with the mainland, where many Taiwan companies are invested. Tsai recognizes that this is a constituency she needs to woo but doesn’t seem clear as to how, beyond saying, “Our challenge is to produce something that is sensible to both sides without being considered as a traitor to the friends we used to be with when we were an opposition party.”
蔡英文要得到傳統民進黨的支持並不難,例如南部選民、年輕選票、還有那些認同自己是台灣人,而不是1949年中國共產黨勝利後來自中國的精英份子。然而,民進黨缺乏與大企業的連結,因為台灣企業大量投資大陸,而其中這些大財團多半支持國民黨,以及與大陸建立更緊密的關係。蔡英文也理解到這是她必須要去吸引的一群選民,但是對於如何進行並沒有太清楚的圖像。她說:「我們的挑戰是要去創造雙方都認為合理的立場,又不能被我們在野時的朋友認為是叛徒。」
That will be hard. The KMT has long argued that it, not the DPP, is best qualified to run the economy, which, corruption apart, did not do well under Chen. Tsai’s supporters concede that many citizens feel the same way—that the DPP can be an effective opposition but not administration. “The KMT has always portrayed itself as more suited to guide the economy,” says J. Michael Cole, a Taipei-based senior fellow with the University of Nottingham’s China Policy Institute and a senior officer at Tsai’s Thinking Taiwan Foundation. “There’s this stubborn perception that a DPP government would be bad for business.”
這是困難的挑戰。國民黨長期主張自己比民進黨更擅長治理經濟,尤其陳水扁執政時期除了貪污,經濟表現並不好。蔡英文的支持者也同意,確實有些民眾認為民進黨可是一個稱職的反對黨,但不是執政黨。諾丁漢大學中國政策研究中心資深研究員暨小英基金會資深主管寇謐將(J. Michael Cole)說:「國民黨把自己描繪是一個更適合主導經濟的政黨。另外也有一種僵化的刻版印象,認為民進黨執政對企業不利。」
It’s a narrative that the CCP backs and may well float as the campaign progresses, either directly, in China’s state-controlled press, or indirectly, through, for instance, its connections in Taiwan’s business community. “Beijing is going to want to make a point through all sorts of channels, including Big Business, that cross-strait relations will not be as smooth if you vote a government into power that has not accepted the foundation that has underpinned developments of the last eight years,” says Alan Romberg, a distinguished fellow at the Stimson Center, a Washington, D.C., think tank.
這種論調受到中國共產黨的支持,並且今隨著選戰的進展不斷被拋出。共產黨可能直接地利用中國控制的媒體影響選舉,或是間接地透過中國與台灣商業界的連結。美國華府智庫史汀森研究中心(Stimson Center)資深學者容安瀾(Alan Romberg)說:「北京將會透過大企業等各種管道來闡述其立場,表明要是台灣人民讓一個不接受過去八年兩岸發展基
礎的政府執政,兩岸關係的發展將不會如現在一樣平順。」
Beijing has never been receptive to a DPP government, but it is particularly negative now. Since coming to power in 2012, China’s leader Xi Jinping has proved himself to be more assertive and nationalistic than most expected, a man not eager to compromise. Last September he told a delegation from the island that China and Taiwan might be one day be reunited under Hong Kong’s “one country, two systems” formula, which is rejected by both the KMT and DPP and, surveys consistently show, the vast majority of Taiwan’s people. This May, Xi warned again about the danger of “separatist forces”—a comment widely interpreted as a swipe at the DPP.
北京對於民進黨政權的接受度向來不高,但現在尤其抱持負面的態度。中國領導人習近平在2012年掌權後,證明自己比外界想像的還更加武斷,帶有更強烈的民族主義色彩,是一個不輕易妥協的人。去年九月,他對一個來自台灣的代表團說,中國和台灣可望採用香港「一國兩制」的模式統一,然而這卻是一個國民黨和民進黨都反對的方案,而且民調也一再顯示,絕大多數的台灣人民無法接受。今年五月,習近平再度警告「分裂主義勢力」會帶來的危險──這段說詞普遍被外界詮釋為對民進黨的抨擊。
Cross-strait relations are managed according to the so-called 1992 Consensus reached by Beijing and Taipei (then also governed by the KMT), a formula the KMT’s Yang calls “a masterpiece of ambiguity.” Under the 1992 Consensus, both sides acknowledge that there is only one China, but without specifying what exactly that means. This, Yang says, has allowed the KMT to move forward on bilateral trade, transport and tourism without being forced to address whether “one China” is the China imagined by Beijing or by Taipei.
兩岸關係是治理目前根據北京和台北(當時為國民黨執政)之間所謂的九二共識,這是一個被國民黨的楊進添形容為「模糊性的一大鉅作」的政策。根據九二共識,雙方承認只有一個中國,但不表明一個中國的確切意含。楊進添說,這讓國民黨在推展雙邊貿易、交通和觀光方面得以取得進展,而不需被迫去回答「一個中國」究竟是北京或是台北心目中的中國。
The DPP has long promoted de jure independence. The first clause in its charter calls for “the establishment of an independent sovereignty known as the Republic of Taiwan,” not the Republic of China, Taiwan’s official name. This platform resonates with the DPP base but is increasingly untenable given China’s economic clout and growing power on the world stage. While the first DPP presidency under Chen was hardly a break from the past, it did see a cooling with Beijing. Things warmed again under Ma. Lin, the Taiwan expert at Shanghai Jiao Tong University, says Tsai is somewhere between Chen and Ma: “If she wins the election, she will not pursue Taiwan in dependence. But she will not promote the development of the cross-strait relationship as Ma Ying-jeou did.”
民進黨過去長期以來推動台灣的法理獨立。民進黨黨綱第一條闡明「建立主權獨立自主的台灣共和國」,而非台灣的正式國號中華民國。這個立場獲得民進黨基本盤的認同,卻在中國的經濟實力成長與中國在世界舞台上崛起之下,越來越無法實現。儘管陳水扁主政時期的民進黨政府跟過去的政策並無太大差別,但跟北京的關係確實趨向冷淡。馬英九主政時期兩岸關係再度暖化。上海交通大學的台灣專家林岡說,蔡英文的立場介於馬英九和陳水扁之間。他說:「如果她勝選,她不會追求台灣獨立。但她也不會像馬英九一樣推動兩岸關係的發展。」
Tsai stresses that she will not alter the politics between Taiwan and China, but she is vague about whether she will repeal the DPP’s independence clause. And unification? That, she says, “is something you have to resolve democratically—it is a decision to be made by the people here.”
蔡英文強調她不會改變台灣和中國之間的政治關係,但對於是否撤回台獨條文卻是依然維持模糊。至於統一呢?她說:「那是必須經由民主程序解決的事情——這是一個必須經由此地的人民來做的決定。」
Hung, Tsai’s potential KMT opponent, says the DPP flag bearer needs to clarify her stance on cross-strait relations. “People ask her, ‘What is the status quo?’ and she can’t say anything specific,” says Hung. The KMT’s Yang offers a metaphor: “Before you harvest, you have to plow the land, transplant the seedlings, fertilize; all the work … has been done by the KMT, and yet they are going to harvest the crop?”
蔡英文的在對手洪秀柱說,民進黨的掌舵手需要清楚地闡明她對兩岸關係的立場。洪秀柱說:「大家問她『維持現狀是什麼意思?』,她卻沒有給具體的回應。」國民黨的楊進添用一個比喻:「在收割之前,要先耕地、播種、施肥;所有的工作……都已經被國民黨完成了,然而他們現在卻想要收割?」
Tsai believes she will win that right. Several days before I return to my Beijing base, over Taiwan-Japanese fusion in Kaohsiung, Tsai is quietly confident that she will gain the trust of Taiwan’s voters and secure victory, whatever Beijing might think. She puts a final piece of tuna on my plate. It’ s from Pingtung County in the south, where she was born. “Go back to Beijing,” says Tsai, “and tell them you were served by the next President of Taiwan.”
蔡英文相信她會贏得這項權利。在我返回北京駐點的前幾天,我們在一家位於高雄的台式日本料理小店用餐,蔡英文對於取得台灣選民的信任並贏得選戰,展現出低調的自信。當時,她把最後一片鮪魚夾到我的盤子上。那塊鮪魚來自南方的屏東,她的出生地。「妳回北京以後,告訴他們,」蔡英文說:「台灣的下一任總統曾經為妳服務過。」
—With reporting by Zoher Abdoolcarim, Gladys Tsai and Natalie Tso/Taipei
─────────────────────
圖片:猜猜看,認出畫風了嗎?^^
(歡迎任何形式分享,一律免問)
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